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The Business of Business Podcast

Sep 14, 2021

Great Leaders Are Developed, Not Born. Start Your Journey of Self Development Today with Sherri McManus and Lou Everett

Are you a leader or want to be a leader? This is an awesome episode to give a listen. Great leaders are developed not necessarily born. You have to work at honing your skills. Some of the more important ones are communication, listening to understand, empathy, patience, confidence, creativity, and many more.

About Sherri and Lou

Lou and Sherri of The Lou Everett Group are known for their highly effective coaching, teaching, and speaking on the importance of personal growth and how it impacts our Influence as a Leader. With more than four decades of combined experience in training, coaching, and leadership, they also have received training and mentoring from well-known and successful coaches and teachers from the likes of Tony Robbins, Zig Ziglar, Brian Tracy, John Maxwell, Jack Canfield, Paul Martinelli, and are Certified Leadership Coaches and Corporate Trainers. 

The Lou Everett Group

“Our mission is to Transform Today’s Leaders by serving people and businesses through leadership coaching, corporate training, empowerment speaking, and personal development.”

As seasoned leadership coaches and trainers with over four decades of combined experience we love serving people and companies throughout their growth transitions. Regardless if you are a solopreneur or at the C-Suite level, Leadership is Influence. Nothing more, nothing less.

We are your thinking partner offering dedicated and customized continuity plans that are designed to, not only resolve your current struggle, but provide proactive support, training and accountability with the goal of avoiding negative impacts on the growth of your business. Our clients have experienced measurable return, increased productivity, and up to 200% revenue growth.    

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Full Transcript Below

Great Leaders Are Developed, Not Born. Start Your Journey of Self Development Today with Sherri McManus and Lou Everett

Thu, 9/9 9:54PM • 58:39


people, leader, leadership, business, manager, grow, develop, metrics, employees, company, lead, coaches, core values, person, point, influence, team, role, drove, work


Sherri, Lou, Lou and Sherri, Roy Barker


Roy Barker  00:00

Your host Roy, of course, this is the podcast that brings you a wide variety of guests that can talk about a lot of diverse topics and today is no different. We have some awesome guests available. Lou Everett and Sherry McManus have taken time out of their day. They are with the Lou Everett group and are known for their highly effective coaching, teaching and speaking on the importance of personal growth and how it impacts influence and influences our leaders. With more than four decades of combined experience in training, coaching and leadership.

They have also received training and mentoring from well known successful coaches and teachers from the likes of Tony Robbins, Zig Ziglar, Brian Tracy, john Maxwell, john Kant, excuse me, jack Canfield, and Paul Martin le, and our soul certified leadership coaches in corporate trainers. Their mission is to transform today's leaders by serving people and businesses through leadership coaching, corporate training, empowerment speaking and personal development, Lou and Sherry, thanks for taking time out of your day to be with us. certainly appreciate it.

Lou and Sherri  01:08

You bet. Thank you for having us.

Roy Barker  01:11

You bet. Yeah, this is such an important topic to talk about. And, you know, we had a little pre show, and we've talked in the past about this is that, you know, leadership is so important. And there are people who are born leaders, I think, but for most of us, you know, it takes work we and hopefully we even if you're good, you always want to be growing and learning as you go. So, before we get too deep, though, I want y'all to tell us kind of how you how you ended up in the space and where you came, you know, your background?

Lou and Sherri  01:45

Sure, that's a loaded question. Yeah. Yes. Okay, okay.

Lou  01:52

I'll start with me, as with my background, little bit, okay. So we both come from various background varying backgrounds, but always tended to be in the leadership space in some fashion. My leadership journey started when I was 17 years old. And I had got my first assistant manager role and thought that I was the big shot. And so since then, we've I've learned a lot failed a lot and had to relearn how to be a successful leader.

And so over the years, I've had roles as as middle management, upper management, executive leadership levels, go in corporate, and have learned a whole heck of a lot, not just from the experience, but from what I've learned by the mentoring and coaches that that I have engaged with over the years, to help me mold into to who I am today. I will say one thing you mentioned about the born leaders, and we're from the thought that there is no such thing, it's a myth, that we have some characteristics of no young when you're born or as you grow, that you may have successful leadership qualities, perhaps.

But as you said, leadership is learned and successful, you're supposed to learn because it's all about influence. It's nothing else. It's really all about how we influence one another in order to accomplish a certain mission right now. But that's kind of in a nutshell, where my background, it all started with my mother. And I was about 12 years old were in instead of being let me listen to my own music in the car.

And I wasn't I was in my own tunes. My mom had different ideas. So she's dropping some drop me off at school or friends or what have you. Instead, it would be cassette tapes of Tony Robbins and Zig Ziglar. And then those, those powerful individuals. And so right from a young age, she started to kind of infiltrate my mind on the idea of what real successful strong leadership and personal growth.

Roy Barker  03:47

That's awesome.

Lou  03:47

So yeah, I'm very lucky. Yeah, very, very fortunate. So that's a little tidbit of me. And so of course, that led us up into where we are today together. But that's another side of the story. That's where I, that's where we come where I come from. And then I met Sherry in 2005. And four months after we met, we started our own business together. Oh, nine 2005. Our first business, I don't recommend it.

Right after you've been going out for a minute, but yeah, it will certainly make or break and determine whether or not it's going to work. Yeah, we real quickly that we would actually work very well together in business as well. And so we've been there because we are a husband, wife duo and and so we realized quickly that we could use each other's strengths to meet to maximize the potential and success of our business. Right.

Roy Barker  04:33

I think that's awesome.

Sherri  04:35

And then mind just an a nutshell. You know, my, my mom always shares a story when I was little, and we had neighborhood kids growing up, used to play outside, and she would walk outside the picture window and here I was a littlest one out of all of them and telling everyone what to do, and what game we're gonna play. I definitely had some characteristics and then as I go, older, I found myself in, in those type of leadership or influential type of positions, and it just kind of fell into it. People just looked up to me, they gravitate toward that gravitated towards me.

So as I got older, I definitely leaned into that definitely fell into some traps and some myths of what leadership is and positional leadership. Because again, you know, you surround yourself of who you think you should be surrounding yourself with, and you fall into some, some traps. And then, you know, as you get more aware, then you realize, oh, okay, this is actually something better. You know, we, I think as we grow up, you get into certain jobs, and you're, we're quickly to point out of what, what not what we don't want in a in a leader or a boss, right?

And you're just like, this is I'm never gonna do that, you know, this is, you know, we're quickly to do that. And then it's far and few between when you could say, wow, I had a great manager, Boss leader. And I really want to emulate some of those characteristics. Yeah, so. So yeah, so just kind of like led up into into that.

Roy Barker  06:06

A couple things I was gonna comment on is first off the husband and wife, you know, my Terry, she's my boss in cheek, it's nice when you can find something that you enjoy doing. And your partner in does it in likes it, you know, it's just, to me, it's great, because we're always talking about things and she understands what's going on.

So if it's hard, it can be hard. So I will say if it works for you, there's really nothing better than in life than having that all wrapped up together. And then I'm gonna send my kids an apology letter, because instead of listening to Tony Robbins, you know, we were listening to Led Zeppelin, then the who, so maybe, maybe I'll tell him I see now. But let's

Lou  06:53

say I was my mother was in the car. My dad, it was a different story. I started listening to some music, right? Yeah.

Roy Barker  07:01

Let's talk about leadership. You know, we talked a little bit about some leadership deficits. And I think this pandemic may have shined the light and brought out the good qualities in some and the bad. And other one thing I can think about is the control factor, with people being at home, and I'm sure that's an issue. But before we even get into that, I think it's talking about being communicative having good communication. And then also, standards, like we talked a little about, you know, making sure that people know what their role and their importance is in the position. So we can set them up for success and not set them up for failure.

Sherri  07:43

Right, like, Yeah, because expectations Definitely, yeah, yeah.

Lou  07:47

Yeah, I think it's important, right? I mean, if you look at it, it's about trust. It really boils down to that, and leadership, doesn't it? If you're if you're managing and leading people, it's it comes down to another trust and empathy and understanding.

Roy Barker  08:01

Yeah, the trust is a big one, because and this gets back to hiring, you know, I do a lot of work with retention. And so we can have all the ping pong tables and frappuccino machines and all of that. But if we make bad hires, that's not going to cure the bad hire, whether it's attitude, skill, whatever. So, you know, making those good hires, we need to hire people we trust.

And if we have an issue with that, from the very beginning, and sometimes it's not even about the candidate, or the new hire, sometimes it's more about us as the manager, and it's hard, you know, smaller businesses. We're used to doing everything ourselves and touching everything. So sometimes that trust and letting go can be a lot more difficult.

Lou  08:45

Sure. Yeah, sure. It can be and see, it's not even well, even that we need to trust our employees or the Trinity, but at the same time, it needs to go the other way around. Yeah. We need to build a culture where employees trust us. Please don't trust the leadership. Yeah, you're gonna see some serious deficit on that side of it to performance retention, issues, things like that, which then, of course, affects the bottom line when you're spending all this money on rehire and retraining.

Yeah. And just another interesting topic we can get into because a lot of a lot of companies tend to ignore the retention issue sometimes until it's on fire. Yeah. But it's the point where they've lost so much already. Yeah. And they want to figure out what it is and why and most of the time they blame it on the wrong thing. Yeah, unfortunately.

Roy Barker  09:40

Well, and that's, you know, the five deadliest words in businesses. We've always done it this way. And I you know, because I come out, you know, I've done a lot of work in the senior living industry, and it's typically hot, very high turnover. That's what even got me to even understand, you know, my background is I work for a huge huge public utility back in the day. And I was I was at this company for almost 20 years and went to night school and that it sparked me to, you know, take some other direction.

But I was the very first person that I knew at this company of 20 years that ever left, because I didn't even know what turnover was. And as I'm going through some graduate work, I looked through a book, and it was talking about this nursing home had, you know, sometimes that industry has over 300% turnover, and I like fell out of my chair, like how, you know, we got an average 100 people working, how do you hire 300 people in a year to, you know, come through this place. It's unbelievable.

And so I started doing the research and you know, finding out the cost of it, the cost is astronomical, even for low lower wage, at the bottom of the scale. It's crazy. And so, you know, kind of focus me on that, which really kind of goes into this leadership, the deficits that we have as leaders, because, you know, again, we've talked a little bit that employees typically will leave managers, not companies.

Lou and Sherri  11:15

Absolutely, yeah, they will, yeah,

Sherri  11:17

it really boils down to the culture, you know, as, as leaders, managers, bosses, however, you want to put a title on that, which is, you know, we come from mythology, that doesn't matter your title, it's about influence, right. So if you have an influence on your business big or small, and if you don't have a people centric culture, that really turns into a very negative situation. And you know, in partly with this pandemic, that has come to light is the players and the pretenders. And it has really stuck out to what organizations are really taking their people seriously.

And I'm not talking about what you just said, you know, ping pong tables and frappuccinos, you know, that's always a nice perk, but having a safe space for individuals that they can feel, feel that they're heard, that they feel cared for, that they their manager has their back. And that is so critical. People much rather have that. And then in turn, the bottom one, which I know everybody's focused on, which I know everybody has to eat, but will produce more. And that's where the attrition can go, you start seeing the the attrition to go lower, as long as the team feels heard.

And you actually take them seriously, and have that and just have that people centric, you know, and you know, I'm reading a book was the Simon Sinek, you know, the infinite infinite game. And it's phenomenal. And it really touches in on this, and about the finite versus the infinite. And the most these companies are in the as a finite is let's just promote people from that have high performance, and they create that culture. And I fell into that trap, and so has Lou to were like, Hey, we're the rock stars, we're good at what we're really doing. And then you get the management role. And you're like, hey, congratulations.

And then six months later, you get fired, because you didn't meet your metrics. Like, well, you didn't equip me. I, you know, I was I supposed to know, you know, and you know, and there's that, you know, it's, it's that constant, you know, you know, hamster wheel over and over again. And now it's time that really got to pay attention to folks that are in this space, such as ourselves to say, listen, are you in the long game?

Are you in the short game? Yes, you can be a billion dollar company, but at what cost to your people? Right? So I can't stress that enough. And that, you know, having that mindset especially, is is key is so key. It's like what culture Are you trying to? or want for your people that work with you? So it's just it's so dire.

Roy Barker  13:54

Yeah. And so many things. I'm taking notes and I've got like a page. But

Lou  14:01

right, I mean, it, this is the reality of it. Okay. If you're in a position, if you're in a position of a leader, whether it's an executive director, or CEO, or CEO, even the bottom line is that that's what drives the business to be able to provide for your employees and your customers that that's that's that is truly important to a business, or mine. It's important years. However, there's a distinctive difference between how we approach it as leaders approach the bottom line and how we get the job done using our people and leading them to do it. There is what we call the trickle down effect.

Though that culture starts at the top that is, okay, the pressure comes down to the CEO or the president or the director of their teams and says, You've got to get this done. This is the goal. We've got to get done by XYZ date. And then how does that person present it to their team right. Now what we see is that presentation is almost mimic pletely It's literally modeled. And we're seeing that it's modeled in a pull to get up, well, you're not performing, you're not doing this, you gotta do this, get it done. Just get it done.

Get it done, get it done. And now you got workhorses instead of teams. Yeah. And then I get burnout, right? They get burnout, they get sick, they leave, they they like you're saying to become disengaged, they lose trust, all because of the presentation, how those teams are presented with their role and responsibility, and heading and how, and how to get the goals accomplished. And why

Sherri  15:31

and we're focusing on the wrong metrics. I'll be pretty bold and saying that we're focusing on performance metrics, which is great. To a degree, it's necessary necessary to point to a point, but we're so obsessed with the metrics that we neglect, that they're, they're humans. And we do have to engage to some degree and not separate the two.

And yes, I was from old school mentality as well. It's like, well, you don't you bring your you take your emotions and leave them at the door. And here, we just work and you work from nine to five. And that's it, you know, kind of thing. And it's like, dang, I don't like that. I'm sorry. But it's not even generational, but people are not tolerating that anymore. They're not. They're really, really not. Yeah. And

Roy Barker  16:17

I think, again, we get back to some things that I know that you've mentioned, communication, empathy, and then the metrics. I love that because at this, this major utility that worked at, we had some awesome metrics that had we applied them to the business and the process helped tremendously. But what we did is we took them as a stick, and we would be employees with the the metrics to the point of is like, well, instead of me showing this, I'm going to show this because it's gonna make me look good.

And then now, you know, after this happened for about six or eight months, all these data that we gathered, that could have been awesome, was worthless, because none of it was true. It was all fictional. And so you know, that's another message that I have is, you know, when you set metrics, you can't use them as a stick to beat people up. Yeah, we have to use them to measure productivity, performance, whatever. But let's get to another great example I use is like marketing. It's like, if you're pouring all this money into marketing, and you tell the sales team will goodness, we drove, you know, 1000 people to your doorstep, from this marketing campaign. What's wrong with you guys?

But if it was the wrong 1000 people, you know, if, if you're selling, you know, let's go to the extreme if you're selling an adult beverage, and you drove 1012 year olds to my doorstep, yeah, it's totally, it's totally worthless. And so that's, you know, to me, those are what metrics instead of beating up the sales team for we drove 1000 people to your doorstep and y'all perform zero, it's let's dig into what happened through this process to see, are they the right 1000 people or not? And, you know, again, we do lose sight of that.

And, to your point about the message coming downhill, you know, my experience, especially in the bigger corporations is, that message picks up momentum and intensity, and, you know, it may have been let's do this, and then it's like, okay, we're gonna do this tomorrow. And then it's like, oh, my God, we're gonna, you know, everybody down the line just emphasizes the point more and more to become so distorted. When you get to the workers. They're like, Oh, my gosh, another emergency. And that's just what we need. Right?

Lou  18:35

That happens all too frequently doesn't exactly too frequently.

Roy Barker  18:40

But um, you know, a couple things, you brought up the communication. I'm big in that, because I talked to my team, and I listened. I didn't always like what they said. They didn't always like what I said. But we had honest communication. The other thing I knew I did is I knew my people. I knew all level, I knew them, their families, their kids what was going on? Because, you know, if they came in a little bit off this morning, I wanted to know, why is it? Is it a big problem?

You know, did you just, it was a little problem driving into work, you got frustrated with traffic? Was it a family problem that's going to linger, because if it is, I need to know about it, so we can plan because that's the biggest thing is, you know, just planning for these things. And it's the, you know, something else you all said to the human factor is that we can't park our personal lives that that door. I mean, it comes in whether you want it to or not, that's as part of being a human being.

Lou  19:36

or sick does, especially nowadays, right. Yeah, a lot of remote work. I mean, we were working from home so much more now. Yes. It's imperative though, that we as leaders understand the human element to what it is that they do, and what their drive is, and their reasons are for what they do. creating a culture of, hey, here's our core value. Use post it up, read it every day every meeting. But where's the living part of it? Yeah, exactly.

And where does that get lost in translation, because the fact of the matter is ROI. And companies as they grow, when they have these core values, and they, and you as the business owner, and you're in your executives and those that are running up and running your business, as a CEO, CEO, President, etc, you've sent out these core values, and you believe that they're being they're being followed, because they're small. But as you grow

Sherri  20:32

such a disconnect,

Lou  20:33

there's that disconnect. And do you really know if it's being followed? Or not? And then you've got that that huge neck goes back to trust? Yeah. Because if and that's why, as you said, Roy, people leave their managers and their leaders, they don't leave the business, they don't leave the company. It's because of how its presented. Yeah. So you're preaching the core values, but man, you treat me like crap.

Yeah, you know, or you you talk to me as if I'm a slave, or the I'm getting verbally abused, or whatever it might be, it creates toxicity, because now those core values really aren't being followed, right. However, every time it you hear the CEO speak, or the director of the team speak, of the department speak, they are so proud of all of these managers that create this toxicity, because they're following core values. And so the employees like, I don't understand what's going on here. Right? These are the core values, this is how they think this should be ran. I want nothing to do with it.

Sherri  21:34

But why are my my teammates crying in their cubicle almost every day? Or why are they getting sick? constantly? You know, it's just that it's, it's, it takes on a physical component. And it's and it's really sad. We've lived it to curse firsthand that, you know, when you when you have this awareness, and I certainly did after my incident and 2018 being in the hospital in the ICU, but, you know, it was this awareness of like, this is a toxic work environment. But you have to have the awareness.

And the sad part is that people when you're in it, you don't realize it until you take a step back or something. catastrophe happens going. Oh, okay. Like I'm in the hospital. Like, where did this dead from? Yeah. And it's so sad. And they're in denial. I mentioned this, and it was like, Oh, no, what are you talking about? Everything? You know, it wasn't, you know, rainbows and sunshine. But yes, it was stressful yet, y'all. Well, that's just the sales environment. No, it's not. Like, I've been another sales departments, and it was not a beating over the head.

You know, you know, process and, and they scared if you're gonna walk in and get fired every day. I'm like, I don't think I've ever had that in all my years. And you know, it's scary. Yes. Because of maybe certain metrics, of course, and performance. But that that's always that's always there. But not to the fact that I'm afraid to work. Yeah, they're scared to come to work. Yeah, that's an issue. Yeah. And unfortunately, some people don't realize that until you talk about it. And you're like, Oh, well, maybe that feeling when I get sick in the morning, or when I'm actually crying in my car before my shift starts?

Lou  23:12

Yeah, night before you can sleep.

Sherri  23:15

That's a red flag. Yeah, it really, really is. And as leaders, it is our responsibility to get noted for that to find out and that goes back to what you said, Roy, you know, get to know your people. And listen, listen, to listen to them, but then take action. I actually manager told me once I had my team, they're like, Great Get to know your people. But they didn't equip me then it tells me how to like, okay, I can have conversations.

But then what, you know, I was still learning myself. Yeah. So they had the intention, they got that point, but then that's it. And then we're like, Okay, let's go back to beating over the head and cranking out and getting all metrics, you know, it was just kind of a very interesting, yeah, that, you know,

Roy Barker  23:57

that used to be them. Yeah, it used to be our model, you know, and, again, I keep going back to this because it was a huge company, but it was like, you know, the the next manager was the person who had either been there the longest, and volunteered, or it was one of the lower men who they forced it on because there's nobody else that would take it in. So you know, I want to get to one other thing before I asked her you know, I want to see what wonder we want to look at for leaders but before that I was gonna mention the the getting sick is this is when I realized that my time at this company had come to an end.

Because me and was with like, three other managers and we two of us were field people. You know, we had people in the field and couple were engineers that did some work. And so we were rad and going somewhere, and one of them's like, Oh, I need to Can you pull over need to go the bathroom? And I'm like, Oh, my gosh, you're like my grandmother. We can't pass a bathroom without you need to pull over. And so then all these three guys chimed in, like, Well, you know, I was young at the time.

I was in my 30s and he I'm doing well like when you've been here for this long, you know, we take heart medication and blood thinner and this and that and you'll be needing to go. I'm like, This job is never gonna drive me to have to take medication I can guarantee and that's when I started looking around and saying, do I really want to be in a job that is forced me to a point that I need to take medication. Now it was, you know, it was the what we used to call the golden handcuffs, because they had good pension.

And that was another trigger. not to get too deep. But you know, the minute the pension changed where it became it wasn't a you know, defined payout, that's when it kind of freed me of that to be able to move, and it was the best thing that happened. Because I want I've always enjoyed what I've done. And I don't want to be in that position. But let's, let's get back to this. You know, part of this is like, the process that we take to bring these new leaders up.

So what are some eight? Well, he used to be either you've been here the longest, or you're the best at your job. Hopefully, we figured out that just because you're awesome at putting together widgets doesn't necessarily mean you're going to be awesome at managing people that put together widget. So what are some Right, right, what are some qualities that, you know, we want to look at to promote that next person

Lou  26:14

will see it's it's all about when it comes down to people, we've got to develop leaders. Right, as we mentioned, leadership is, is learned it's not automatic. learning, learning to be a successful, positive leader, influential leader takes time and it takes development. So it's not gonna happen overnight now. So in a company, and in a business, the focus needs to be what is your succession plan? All right. What are you how are you building up those that that you you feel would be would be solid leaders? How are those that are willing to want to learn how are you developing those people, that's really what it comes down to right leadership starts and ends with you as the leader, period.

And so for you to is for so qualities that you would look for in everyone has so many different qualities and variances depending on the company, right? what it is that they're looking for. But if somebody is if somebody comes in, and they're just solid, they're coming in, they're working, they're doing what they need to do, they're, they communicate well, we all have deficiencies. It's a matter of identifying people that personally have a goal and understand your values, understand the mission of the business in the company, and are willing to do what it takes to accomplish that mission, within reason.

And within within the ethical means of the core values, then those are people that and if they're willing to want to learn to become a leader, and they can see themselves there, those are people that you want to take under your wing, and find a way to create a development plan to see how they move along and how they're able to grow. Because then when they get to that point, now they've they've got some some solid foundations, then you promoting individuals that have proven themselves that they've been able to leave their peers, as well see, peer leadership is huge.

Because you know, you've influenced people around you, they come to you, and they follow you and what you do not because they have to because you're not paying them you're not their boss, you're their appear, but they do it because of who you are your performance, your communication. So if you an influencer appears to follow you. That's a great example of any leader to build to see that the peers actually looked up to this person a lot as well. Yeah. And to find out from those peers, what is it? What is it?

What are the characters that you like about this individual? When it comes to to the job, you see the one then you can identify those types of people? Would you have to do that get to listen to them to identify that and not play the political game and in promoting people it was person sold $2 million this year, they've got to be the director next. That doesn't mean you can they can sit there and manage and direct and lead a 25 person team of salespeople that do the same thing at all, by any means. You know, I mean, it's pure and simple, right?

Roy Barker  29:01

And they may not even want to is the other thing, sometimes we kind of forced that on people. Like I'm happy here sell and doing what I'm doing. I don't necessarily want to be thrust into that position.

Sherri  29:12

That's a and that's okay, too. And that and see, that's again, that's the responsibility partly of, you know, of seeing that communication to figure out going okay, here's a great rock star, but do they even what is their future? What do they want? You know, did they want a leadership role eventually? Or maybe Hey, they're happy making, you know, that X amount of dollars and they're happy they got a system and that's fine. It's all they want to get all their money.

Yeah. And that's all they want to do. Guaranteed. Like, you know, this is great for your listeners. Here's the challenge. Guaranteed any doesn't matter what position that you are, I bet you if you ask someone who is someone that you can talk to or go to your go to person, that if you had a question about something at work at work, other than you know your your typical boss or your outside of your side Right, guaranteed they're all gonna point to one person. Yep. Right. And then the opposite is true, which is like, who is the biggest jerk and your team? They're all gonna point to,

Roy Barker  30:11

you know, and that's something I talked about in the, in the employee retention process, think is that when you bring new new people on, you know, I'm not gonna get into the whole onboarding thing, because I think we do that wrong, too. But I think we need to provide that mentor, who is good for people to go to. And so, you know, that may be a litmus test is, you know, provide if, if you think you have a good candidate for leadership, you know, make them a mentor to see, you know, ask that question.

But because I had, you know, the situation that I had, one of the guys that they would send people to I don't know what he was a great worker, but he was a little bit twisted in his thinking. And so I was with him and a guy came up and asked a question about this specific situation, he gave me an answer, he walked away, I said, Well, why didn't you tell him that, you know, this has been happening at this location. And that's where he needs to start.

He's like, I had to figure it out on my own, like, he needs to figure it out on his own to I'm like, oh, my goodness, we're missing the whole point, we should be helping each other through. And so anyway, you know, that was, to me, that was not the guy that he needs to be promoted. Because that's not to me wasn't a great leadership skill to say, Hey, you got to figure this stuff out on your own, we should all be helping each other.

Lou  31:32

Exactly. Right. Even if even if that's the case, right? Even if you did promote, what is your plan? When you promote someone to a leadership role, when you've promoted them? What is your plan to develop them in that next level? To assess where they currently are in leading teams? What is their communication? So how do they lead a team? How do they identify what their other team's communication style is? it if you but if you can equip them. I mean, it was a perfect example.

There was a company years ago that I worked for, for the first two weeks, all we did was leadership development training, before I can even step foot and make any decisions in my role was a great experience for me to open up my eyes. I'm like, Well, I can do this. I've been management, why would like nope. This is what we all do to all of our leaders and develop them. I learned so much. And yeah, it was two weeks, you got to pay these people still. But that development makes a huge difference. When it comes down to leading a team.

What are we doing? We're not I mean, I'm not saying hey, listen, unless they're like, Mr. Leadership, Joe, we can't promote them. What I'm saying is, is have a plan in place. Is there a development plan for your employees that are interested? If you mean, it's the nowadays, it's so easy, you know, you connect with a company like ourselves, or anybody else that provides opportunity for them to have like an online platform where they can go in and if they've selected on, I'm going to sit in leadership development, well, at least get something started to find out with an assessment where they already get some background, right, because that's succession planning.

And it keeps people engaged, and gives value to what it is that they do and the values of the company, then when you need somebody, you know, these five people have been developing themselves for the last two years through this program that we have for them. Well, we're going to interview those people for this role. Right? That's, that's the, that is the intentional decision of making a decision on who you move into roles that are going to fully develop their teams.

Roy Barker  33:30

Yeah, and talking about planning and strategy. I think that's good. Because sometimes we especially as newer businesses, or growth mode businesses, it's like, they come in on Monday, and like, Oh, my gosh, we, you know, we need to add somebody here. And so we make these reactive decisions. Instead of like, you know, taking a little bit further approach and saying, what are our triggers for this growth.

And, and then our, you know, for putting on a new manager, a new leader, and so we need to be training them up and developing in this time that we have, we don't want to wait till Monday morning. Like, we got to hire somebody today, you know, and it's like any meenie miney mo, who's not gonna be is taking the approach is that at some point, if you're in a growth mode, or if you want to grow your business, you're gonna have to add these managers. So get out in front of that, and at least develop them.

Lou  34:24

Agree, meet them where they are, and meet them where they are. And if you if you have a plan in place for you to develop them. Great. I want to have a development plan in place for those that are that want to become leaders in the business. Yeah, then because there's going to be emergencies that come up. The director of this department resigns last minute, watch, we've got to get somebody in there ASAP. Right? Well, but if you've developed your people,

Sherri  34:48

but if you've already had that proactiveness and already had that as a culture already had that as a, you know, in that, then it's a National Society, you know, natural to be like, Oh, well go So now we have a pool of people, right? And then you're constantly thinking that forward that forward thinking and being proactive. And what's happening is that, you know, we're stuck in these, this old mentality is that, you know, we have people or organizations, and it doesn't matter, I was a state government worker for seven years. So it's almost the same.

That until we're putting our backs in a corner, until there's this huge fire, that's all of a sudden, it's like, oh, we need to do something, you know, it's just like, really? Like, haven't we learned, you know, that we need to be? Yes, it sounds good in theory, when people Oh, you need to be forward thinking and being proactive? Well, there's a truth to it. No, any of the greats that we have out there that we've mentioned early on, there's truth to that. So why not heed that and actually do something about it, even if it's just a little bit.

Have a transformation table, having bringing certain leaders to a table, that are kind of have those qualities that we pointed out that are like, hey, everybody's going to this person, or they got something, bring him in on something, make a decision, you know, hey, that bring him into that, that world, right, you know, and see how they handle a little bit, you know, there's nothing wrong with that. But again, you know, when they get certain leaders, unfortunately, they get so busy in in, in their jobs and what they have to do and putting out fires.

That they just don't have that that moment, unfortunately, to grow, continue to grow, because they blame it on time management, and they just think they know it all. Yeah, you know, and I hit the top and, you know, the cliche of like, oh, leadership is so lonely at the top, I'm like, Well, you did it wrong. Yeah, you know, you know, you forgot to bring some people behind you, you know, to come up. So you know, and that's why we're just so passionate about it, because we can go on and on about it.

But and you are too raw, you know, it's just like, history, here's its leadership sad, that it's a reminder to these newer leaders, that are now starting their own businesses, thanks to COVID because they got tired of the other and, and fall into that old reality. Yeah. You know, it's like, grow, you know, treat yourself, lead yourself before lead. keep growing and having that growth mindset versus a fixed mindset. And it has to be intentional about it. And by doing that, and I'll give you a tip here is that watch who you are around with.

Jim Rohn says, the best man, if you are the average of the five people that you surround yourself with, and that is through mentors, put yourself with coaches, put yourself even reading a book of the greats that are out there and take a little bit here. But then next step, actually apply it. Is it readable? Great. But then you put it back on the shelf,

Lou  37:57

right? and accountability to Yes, and accountable, gotta be accountable, right, you got to make sure somebody's got to be there to make sure hold your feet to the fire, make sure you accomplish what you've read and studied and learned on

Sherri  38:08

and share that out, you know, read a little bit do a little bit. And that's exactly what our mentors have shared with us. And you know, we're coaches, but we have five coaches. Don't be so proud that you're a coach, and you know, everything. I don't care if you've been in for 27 years, you still have a coach. Yeah, I got five coaches, right? I'm I'm not that much.

Roy Barker  38:28

Well, you know, that's what they they always say. And I think as once people get to the top, sometimes they think that they're the smartest one in the legal saying that, you know, if you're the smartest man in the room, you need to find another room. And I just think that's even when we get to the top we have to surround ourselves with people we can trust that can give us good advice, because we're never going to know it all.

We can't watch it all. And that, you know, we've talked about a lot, but also, you know, something we mentioned earlier about people at the top not knowing what what's going on at the bottom, is you need to get out of your office and get out, you know, to the lower levels, go see what's really happening out there. Pick up the phone and call you know, if you if you have an office call, how's that call handled when it comes in.

I mean, these are things that we can't just forget about, we always have to be thinking about them, you know, even at the very top. So the other thing talk for a minute, you know, we've talked more about the corporate side, but let's talk about personal growth because there are a lot of people that like you said, the pandemic has forced them to be in business, maybe they had a skill or a trade they were a plumber maybe would work or whatever. But now they're they want to grow the business and add people. So let's talk a little bit about some opportunities to do this on our own.

Lou  39:51

Yeah, we'll see. And as I mentioned before, it all start as a leader see, again, leadership is influence right even though even though you may not have a position In a leadership role, I believe we're spot we're all leaders in some fashion, if we use our influence on purpose, right, in a way that brings value and helps in a positive way that that is, that is a def true definition of a leader is that influence? Yeah.

And so it starts and ends with you, Sherry and I have developed a method called the empowerment method, we've we're co writing a book offering a book that is going to be released August September, called empowerment leadership, the 10 principles every leader must follow to lead with influence, okay. And empowerment, doesn't have an E on it, it starts with the M is empowerment, there's 10 letters, and each letter corresponds to a principal, okay, that first principal is me, the me principal, that all starts and ends with you, if you do not develop yourself as a leader.

You can't develop other people. See, the reality of it is, is that you can only you can only give at the limit of your own growth, right? Get only give it a limit of your own growth, you can't expect that you're going to be able to lead a team of people, whether it's your business or not, if you haven't developed yourself as a leader, so that you can lead people, right. So it all starts there. And it all ends there as well, because that's the responsibility and burden of a leader is making sure that we develop other people, and it starts with us.

Roy Barker  41:29

Yep. And even if you're going even if you're young, starting out going into the corporate role. You know, my advice is always seek out coaches like yourself to to grow yourself, you may not maybe you don't have any aspirations. But maybe you do. Or maybe you don't today at 25, but maybe at 35 you do. If you develop these skills, then it will be an easier transformation to step in to that role. Or, actually, you don't really step into it.

I think, like you were saying earlier that you kind of become that mentor, person that people go to before that, but then it's an easier transition, you know, to step into more of a manager or the title of some form of leadership. And I think that's on us. Because, you know, back in the old days, I'm guilty of this, we, you went to a job and you expected them to do everything or tell you this is when you go to this development or do this or do that. But you know, if if you want to do something on your own, or even be successful in a company, the burden is still on us as individuals. Of course,

Lou  42:35

that's our accountant. There's that accountability piece, right? And it's our responsibility if we want to grow or succeed, yeah, we've got to identify what is it that I need to do? And we don't know what we don't know. You don't know what you don't know. So it's time to ask those that might and use those resources. I can't tell you if I had one thing to do over again, we've been asked this question, if there's one thing that you as a leader could do differently, what would it be? And hands down is I would have surrounded myself with the right mentors and coaches a lot sooner than.

Exactly, yeah, does it it makes a significant difference. And they could speed up your growth by easily 75 to 85%. Now, by doing that, so that is absolutely something I recommend. And perhaps perhaps there's someone out there as in one of your listeners that have experienced this where, hey, I was just promoted into this role. I know I want it, because I know I want to move up. But man, my manager, if I'm ready, and my manager didn't give me i'm not i'm not sure if I'm ready for this. How do I lead 25 people?

Heck, I was able to, to, you know, help my peers, but how do I leave 25 people, I'm not sure where to start. And unfortunately, there's no playbook that can be thrown at you yet. If you don't, if you're if you're a leader, if you're a leader that has now moved somebody into a new role as a new manager, a young new manager, right, fairly fresh to leadership, and you are not coaching them, mentoring them, guiding them along to become a successful leader. You're doing it wrong. And unfortunately, you should not be a leader at all.

Because that is the burden and responsibility of us as leaders to provide that type of development to those that the lead, right. However, we can say that all the time. We've preached this all the time, but it's not a miracle. It's never it's not going to happen. 100% all over the place. That's why people need us. Yeah. Okay. And that's okay.

However, that's where that empowerment leadership method and that system comes into place because that we believe that that is that is the rewriting of this old 1970s playbook of how positional style leadership and how you run a business should be played. Instead of capitalism. Its people isms, what I call it, yeah, it's time for us to get back into that. Exactly. And when it comes down to business.

Roy Barker  44:58

Yeah, and, you know, we've talked a lot about business in the profession. But this also transcends that. Because as family people, we need to be leaders in our families, if we have kids, we need them to buy into what we're trying to trying to sell them. Because you know, you know, people are always like, it doesn't matter what position yours like, I'm not in sales.

But you know, really, we're all in sales. We're all trying, you know, we have a spouse, we're trying to sell them on, you know, something, if it's kids, we're trying to sell them on how to be, you know, what we think are good citizens, and this so that leadership, those leadership qualities can transcend our work very easily.

Lou  45:36

Absolutely. Yep. And that's why that leadership is influence piece, right? It's not about position at all. Yeah, it's about how you're influencing those around you, right? Because if you do it in a way that's impactful and done on purpose, not only is it going to influence and impact your family in a positive way, it's going to impact those around you, your community, your neighborhood, your city, your state, your country, the world, but you have to develop other people in the process, right?

Hey, I've mentored this person, I've influenced this person, do me a favor to pay me back, go do that for somebody else. Right. And then next thing, you know, you're you're you're changing things. You're transforming the whole idea there.

Roy Barker  46:12

Yeah. And we can't be scared to give that away. I mean, I know Charles business, y'all make money off this. But I'm just saying, in general in life, if sometimes people are very protective, like, Oh, I don't want to tell them how I did this. And we need to be open and free to give that information to co workers or, you know, even people that may be work at other companies. It's not. I don't know, I guess it also kind of, we get what we put out there, the old karma thing. And so, you know, we want to put as much good stuff out there as we possibly can, means helping people and I like that people, people ism, is that what?

Yeah, I mean, I love that, because I think that we've become so focused that like, you know, in that in my prior you utility experience, we became so focused on the quarterly results, that we were making poor decisions that impacted people poorly, if we get back to making these decisions that really empower our people, and support them and do what we need to do for them. That I am a firm believer that the profits will follow, we're not going it doesn't have to be detrimental to our bottom line to care about our people and do the right thing.

Lou  47:25

Agreed. It's a side effect, right? You treat you you develop your people, well, you treat your people well, we can't be a leader without people. I'm not meant to be a leader that I know of. And in history that is a leader without people, that's just we need people to be to lead, right? We need them to lead. And but the side effect of leading them effectively, and successfully is the profit, right? You know, so don't getting wrapped up in that and people before profits is our motto.

And I've we believe that 100% I've seen it even with other coaches and leaders in those similar leadership space that we are, right, we invite people, that's let's have we do one on ones and talk with those that most people consider a competitor? Yeah, we don't we don't consider that. We can't handle how many millions of people in the world. Yeah. But we need more people to do that. And it's it's not about again, it's not about like, I'm not giving you my secrets. It's about how can I help you help them exist, it's not about us. It's about them.

And every leader, whether you're a coach, a leadership consultant, whether you are in a leadership position, that needs to be your mentality, it's not about us, it's about them. When that focus is pivoted your decisions that you make, how you develop people, you start looking at it entirely different. Because I promise you, you follow those types of models. profit will happen because people will love to work with you. Yeah, they'll want to follow you and they'll listen to you.

Sherri  48:59

And also how you make a person feel last longer than anything else. Yeah.

Roy Barker  49:05

And you also remember the most I remember Brett Yeah, and I think it's also helps with talent attraction, is that when the word gets out that it's awesome to work here that they support their people, they you know, we treat you right, people are lining up at your door announce instead of you know, because always say we want to be an employer of choice, not an employer of last resort.

And so now instead of having to pick through the leftovers of the applicants that just couldn't get hired anywhere. Now we've got to the pick of the cream of the crop because everybody wants to come work here so it's and that's exactly what business

Sherri  49:41

that speaks volumes to that is Chick Fil A if you've done any research or any type of history regarding the the owner of that business that started it, and it comes up every time especially in this leadership space, and I you know leaned in a little bit more on why is this so like fantastic. What the heck It's chicken right? Yeah. It's because he had the people first mentality. And there's people constantly for employees that want to work there.

And they're always adding new people all the time, they don't just sit there and have an open, like, Oh, we need people, and then they close the door, oh, we need people again. And they're not doing that it's a constant revolve, revolving as far as getting new talent in, and then the ones that don't want to stick around and kind of weed themselves out anyway. And that's okay, because here's another Rockstar that's gonna come right behind. Yeah, with that.

Lou  50:31

So perfect example of how the quality of their product is a representation of the quality of people, right, and the quality of the people or the representation of the quality of leadership, and all interconnects

Roy Barker  50:47

and it's the quality of service to because they train their people to go above and beyond because I think it's that, you know, the the management cares so much about their people, but they also instilled that we have to care this much about our customers too. And so, definitely one of the better, you know, quick dining experiences that's out there, for sure.

And then, you know, they always get a lot of press about how they develop owners think that's a location that's not too far from us. It was a young lady that started as a team member in high school worked away up. Now she's got her own franchise. So you know, it's it's a great success story.

Lou  51:29

Yeah, that's a perfect example of developing people. Yeah, yeah.

Roy Barker  51:33

Well, guys, I know we're running way late. We could talk about this for two or three more days, I'm sure. I mean, we're, I feel like we're all passionate. So do me a favor, though. You know, when when y'all get ready to release the book, late summer, I wish you would give me a call. And let's get back together. I'd like to have y'all back on again, like I said, so much.

This goes in so many different directions. I don't think we could ever cover it all. But it's been a pleasure speaking with y'all. So before we get away, what is a tool that y'all use? And if it's collectively good if you got separate ones, but what is a tool or a habit, something that you use every day that really adds value? personally, professionally?

Sherri  52:15

Yeah, I'll start with that. What I actually what I do every day, and thanks to my mentors, and I have implemented it ever since is that I do a reflection at the end of the day, I actually put it on my calendar and actually do a daily reflection. And on the top of that word document, as simple as it is, is really well review, mark the winds and the defeats, but also who did I add value to today?

And it really makes me sit and think because we get so caught up in our day to day and you know, activities that we really have to take that moment to be like, okay, maybe who did I introduce somebody to who did I help? What did I give advice to, you know, and then to really pin that out, and you can just jot it down. And that has, it's sometimes it's a pain in the butt cuz you're like, Oh, I don't want to do it. But then I'm like, no, it's worth it keeps your focus,

Lou  53:07

that's good. For me, it's like that, that there I do that, I do a reflection as well. But Sherry has a very specific system she uses which works out great. But for me, with just two things that I do every day, every single day, daily, there's really six things a leader should do every single day, but we won't get into those. But there's two things that I would recommend everybody do. Okay? Number one, I read something every day that relates to to helps me grow as a coach, as a leader and also as a leader, as a corporate trainer.

And as an executive leadership developer, I always read something every day that I try to look at and how I can implement that. And the second thing that I do every day when I'm, you know, we're done work and we're downstairs after dinner, or you know, chilling out in the living room or whatever, I'll take a moment. And I'll go through in my mind, Rolodex in my mind or in our CRM and see if there's people, our clients that we've worked with in the past that we work with now that I haven't spoken to for a while.

I haven't reached out to in a little while. And I'll try to find a way to reach out to them, send them something specific in an email or record, give them a phone call. They haven't heard from you in a little while How you doing and keep keep those relationships strong. So people understand that we are here for them and it doesn't cost them anything or me anything but time just to just to reach out. Because relationships is what builds successful leadership. So those are two things that I do everyday

Roy Barker  54:37

Yeah, and I like that. Sherry about writing down the people that we've helped. That's something I've never thought Yeah, and that's why I asked this question because I love to collect good habits and I feel like you know this is introducing these good habits to others out there but really taking stock of that and one more thing about our you know, what we got done is I tried to tell people celebrate what you did get done, because you know, we can be the hardest on ourselves.

And, again, I'm the example that I had 10 things on my list to do today, I got seven done, and I'll kick myself, you know, for the rest of the day about these three. If I could hit 700, I would be making gazillions of dollars, you know, playing baseball. So we have to look at that, you know, if you can get, let's celebrate what we're doing right, and we can work on those things that we need to fix. Right?

Lou  55:00

celebrate your wins. I like it.

Roy Barker  55:18

Yeah. All right, guys. Well, thanks so much. Tell everybody, of course, you know, who you work with? How you can help them? And then of course, how can they reach out and get a hold of you? Sure.


We work with small businesses, but have a team generally, you know, any anywhere from our the sweet spot is anywhere from 50 to 300. employees, in that I have teams and that are finding that they're growing, and that there is some gaps there they're trying to fill, because it's starting to get big now or as a business owner, hey, you know, how do we how do we keep the communication going? How do we keep the lines open? Who do maybe who I put in what places here as far as positions? Or who do I lead?

How do I assess those are those are, that's a great example of companies that that are, have grown to the point where now they're starting to get some negative feedback from employees, there's like this negative culture, but they don't know where it came from. We have assessments that we can provide to, for the entire company to find out where those opportunities are, to put in place a process and a program to help reduce that gap and bring that success better.

We also work with new managers who have just been promoted or even been in manager and maybe they're their boss has now been replaced and as a different type of person. And here we are, I don't know how to deal with this person. No one I love dealing with leukemia, I don't know how to deal with this person. As a matter of fact, they've given me 10 things I got to fix the next six months or I'm out, yeah, like those are the types of things that we help we help with, we have seen a significant increase in improvement in businesses.

We also have a sweet spot for solo entrepreneurs just because we are entrepreneurs. So we do have a sweet spot there too. And we have we've we absolutely will help as they're growing and bringing people in and how to develop those those individuals to become strong employees and take on roles as they move along and grow. We have seen up to a 550% increase in revenue, and in growth, business growth with those types of individuals as long as they follow the process of accountability that we provide them.

Because we give them homework and they've got to get it done to make sure they're successful. So that those are the desk. Those are who we work with and where we love to work with. But we're open in conversation with anybody just to see if what is that we can do to help because if we can't help you, we can point you in the right direction.

Roy Barker  57:53

That's awesome. Yeah, yeah. And yeah,

Sherri  57:57

they can reach us anywhere on our website, Lou Everett Group We're on Instagram, Facebook and LinkedIn, feel free to reach out even Google Lou Everett Group, and I guarantee will be up there. So

Roy Barker  58:09

we're all over it. All right. Awesome, guys. Well, thanks so much. that's gonna do it for another episode of The Business of Business Podcast. Of course, I'm your host Roy. You can find us at We're on all the major social media platforms as well as the major podcast platforms iTunes, Stitcher, Google Spotify, for not a one that you listen to please reach out I'd be glad to add added on. So until next time, take care of yourself and take care of your business.