Data-Driven Decisions To Get The Best Results With Your Digital Marketing

Mar 11, 2021

Data-Driven Decisions To Get The Best Results With Your Digital Marketing with Cross Palalas

Cross is a VP of Marketing for a Media Agency at just 22 years old, I've taken over 500 of the world's top Brands & Creators to the next level!

Obsessed with success, I am an experienced data-driven marketing professional with over 7 years of experience in digital and traditional marketing. I have owned & operated a successful Marketing Agency, working for a Global Fortune 500 company to consult on holistic digital marketing strategies for Top Marketing Agencies across North America.

I am now the VP of Strategic Optimization at Secret Sauce Media where I oversee both the Paid Media and Organic Social teams. During this time, I have developed an and implemented successful Marketing strategies to drive success for over 500 of the worlds top Brands & Creators! 

Full Transcript Below

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (00:03):

Hello, and welcome to another episode of the business of business. I'm Roy. We are the podcasts that we bring you great guests from a wide variety of disciplines to help you in your business. I know as a solo preneur entrepreneur, small businesses, sometimes we don't know what we don't know. So this is a great opportunity to learn about new and exciting things. And not only that, but bring in some experts so that if you do recognize that you have an issue, we can give you a place to go, you know, and find help. Uh, today we are fortunate enough to have cross palace with us. He is the VP of strategic optimization at secret sauce, media, where he oversees both paid and organic social teams. Uh, during his time in the marketing space, he has implemented six developed and implemented successful marketing strategies to drive success for over 500 of the world's top brands and creators cross. Thanks for taking time out of your day to be with us. Uh, how's everything going for you today?

Cross (01:11):

Things are going well, very excited. Glad to be here. Good. Good for having me

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (01:16):

Good. Yeah. You know, we can never get enough of marketing and the digital space for sure. Uh, it is a, uh, it's, it's an ever-changing world. And just about the time that you think you, well, let me say this for, for lay people like me. Who's this is not my, uh, you know, this is not what I do every day. About the time I get caught up on it. I talked to experts like yourself and realize that I'm probably about two or three steps behind. So that's kinda what we're going to, uh, you know, get in today is, you know, so what are some good strategies, uh, some good things that, uh, people can think about to help get their message out there and, you know, advertise and market for their business.

Cross (02:03):

Awesome. All sounds good. I know marketing is something that it's changing rapidly 24 seven, especially when you look at digital marketing it's ever-changing

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (02:13):

Right, exactly. Yeah. And with social media, you know, um, and I just, I just kind of going to throw this out there, um, to begin with, because I was, I got flooded with the guy that was sending me a bunch of ads about, uh, you know, get more likes on social media, Instagram in particular. And you know, what I think about, I guess my opinion on that is that some of the likes and chatter it's vanity, if they are not people who could be a consumer of your product. So I think we have to be sure and distinguish that factor because a lot of people that I know get sucked into, you know, paying these guys this money, and then all of a sudden they've got a bunch of followers from all the world, but they're not people who would actually ever be their clients. Exactly. Yeah. So I just feel like the, uh, you know, especially the social media, just, just be careful of who you're dealing, make sure they're reputable and they can give you a good plan. But, um,

Cross (03:18):

Yeah, people will tell you anything when it comes to social media, I've had people who I talk to and they have clients spending thousands of dollars for light campaigns on Facebook. And I'm like, why? I'm like, well, they want to make sure that people are engaging. And I was like, show me these campaigns. Cause we were spending that much on engagement. Are you really getting people who are going to use your service or are you just getting likes for the sake of having links? Right,

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (03:43):

Right. Yeah. And likes don't, I don't know. I, I think you'd be hard pressed to take likes to the, uh, you know, to the phone company and see if you could pay your bill with them lithium or something like that. So yeah. We just need to make sure our strategy. So what is, uh, and the other thing, you know, well, let me ask you this, not to say it, let me ask this question. And so, you know, there are platforms like Google being, um, a lot of places, what I would call more on the internet side where people may be, uh, searching through not necessarily a social media platforms, such as a Facebook or Instagram. So does the, does it depend on the business that you're in kind of how much effort you want to put into either one? Is it usually a pretty good mix of 50 50? Or what, what is your take on that?

Cross (04:38):

I'd say it really varies. So something like e-commerce, for example, something where social media is ideal, especially if you've got very little cost products and it's hot and balls, you can get the awareness and have that bottom funnel in there and still drive, you know, really high ROI ways. Whereas something, for example, um, a little bit more lead gen related. I know I've been dealing a lot with clients who are doing, uh, solar panels recently. Yeah. For them it's, I'd say about 60%, 70% on the Google side, because it's more search space to start that relationship than it is finding on social. And then what we do is once they've gone to the site and they've started clicking around, we then re target them on social because we know that there's an interest there. And it's just about staying top of mind getting in there and they're more likely to then start converting that lead. Um, so it's definitely a very healthy mixture.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (05:34):

Yeah. And you mentioned the funnel, if you don't mind, can you just go over a sales funnel for any listeners that may not actually understand the components and the importance of that?

Cross (05:47):

Yeah. So funnels are really, really great. There's all different kinds, but the basic kind of sales funnel that I usually use is a three tiered system. So at the top you have that awareness stage. This is when people are getting to know who you are. So these are people who had no to about you. Maybe they'd see your social media video later this year ad for the first time. Okay. Now I know I'm aware of you, uh, then you've got that consideration stage. So this is where maybe they'd fill out a lead form. Maybe they're, you know, just kind of viewing your content a little bit more, getting to really contemplate or making that purchase decision. And then at the bottom you have that conversion. So you're got that person who's handing you money for the job or for the product.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (06:27):

Okay. Yeah. And you mentioned a good point earlier about lower cost items versus I guess, a higher cost, um, services and products. And typically I think that funnel kind of collapses, you know, if we're talking and I'm gonna speak for myself, uh, for this, is that, you know, if I see something I kind of like it's three, four or five bucks and I'll have to do a lot of thinking about that. I'm going to click it, get it, you know, if it works out, that's good. If it doesn't, it's not that big of a deal, you throw it away and, and know not to buy it again. But when you're talking about a 5,000, 10,000, $25,000 item or service, I think that that's where that consideration point becomes much more important is that I need to know who cross is before I write you a $10,000 check or before, you know, the other thing that we don't think enough about, I think too, is our brand, is that, um, we need to, uh, build that relationship where I have the trust in you because, you know, if I turn my campaign over to, you have basically turned my brand, my reputation, and, um, I need to make sure that we are both aligned in that messaging as well.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (07:43):

So it's important to, and you know, I will ask again, I asked this question to you as the, um, as the person that carries that out, you know, having that, um, uh, a long conversation before that you actually make a client it's important for both sides, because I need to be important. I mean, I need to be confident in your messaging, your what tactics, what you're gonna do, but you also need to be confident in me because you know, your reputation is on the line. If I've got a crummy product or service, if I'm ripping people off, that gives you a black guy too. So I think that that conversation needs to be had for both sides of that.

Cross (08:25):

Exactly. Definitely a conversation to be had. Another big one is expectation. So a lot of people hear social media marketing, you hear all the gurus doing e-commerce sites who are probably selling those low cost products. And, you know, they've got 20, 30 X ROI and they're spending, you know, very low budgets. Right. Um, and then somebody who's got a $50,000 service they're trying to sell expects to go online, spend a hundred dollars at half screen appliance tomorrow, correct? Yeah. A $50 product is a lot of money or even a service. So I'm going to have a much longer time that I'm thinking about this. So just putting one out in front of me at a low cost, isn't necessarily going to have me convert like this. You really got to look at how much are you looking to spend in the long run rather than putting up a little bit of money and hoping that everybody just flocks to you. Right?

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (09:15):

Yeah. And I think the other point of that, it's who you reach with that ad because you know, the low cost items, you know, you may reach that consumer, but let's say it's at $50, $50,000 service. Um, I am probably not. My messaging is probably not reaching the guy who was going to make that final decision. I, in my, in my experience, you reach a lower level person. Who's like, Hey, this is good. They kind of run it up the chain to get that interest that do you, is that a fair assessment of how that usually works?

Cross (09:53):

Exactly. Like even me, I was, uh, looking at temporary services for bringing in, uh, new hires at our company. So different hiring agencies and stuff like that. And then I started getting served ads and stuff, but I'm not the one who was making the decisions on who we're partnering with. So I'm just saying, Hey, this is a company that seems really good. They came across me on Facebook. Here's an ad, take a look, see what you can do with them. Yeah.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (10:16):

Yeah. So the old, uh, aggregate Arion, um, example, it could not be more truer. I think the higher you work your way up, the price point is you have to, uh, so, and then you have to cultivate before you can reap. And, and I think that we've missed that a lot in, um, well in our instantaneous society, you know, everybody gets instant gratification. I want to, like you said, I want to put an ad out there. And then I'm just sitting here waiting by my phone. Um, you know, I, I hit the go button on my ad five minutes ago, and now I'm waiting for my phone to ring. Like I said, the lower price points. When you have a buy button, you know, you'd probably get some generation immediately, but that, um, the higher price points, I think, um, there's going to be the wider, um, that cultivation point is going to be wider.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (11:09):

And it's going to take more work because you have a lot of people, not only do I need to convince you that you need to take me up to your superiors, but then you have to start working on them. And the other thing I think that we forget is, okay, I'm a sales guy. I just pushed out this ad or this email. And, you know, I think Cross's sitting at his desk looking at his screen, just waiting for my message to come across so he can jump into action and buy. And, you know, I think we have to think about our buyers are very, very busy people. Their schedules are crammed. And so, uh, again, that gets back to maybe something more on the order of a drip campaign to stay in front them. No, you're not. Let me say that two number one, they're busy.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (11:56):

And even if they want to buy right this minute, I think that, um, it may take some time for them to get our message sink in, have time to act. But the other thing is you may not need what I'm selling right now, but that doesn't mean that you can't be a customer. So can you talk to us a little bit about, you know, maybe the, uh, kind of a smaller drip campaign where we're not like just unloading a big message on everybody, you know, kind of a data dump, but we're more just kind of dribbling that kind of keep our name in front of people.

Cross (12:30):

Yeah. So this is something that's really, really important, especially when you look at things that are higher ticket items or longterm purchases. I'll use myself as an example. Uh, my purchase journey for our car has been about the last three months so far. I still haven't made the purchase. Uh, and there's one local dealership that has really stayed top of mind for me. And I'm 90% sure when I'm ready to make the purchase, uh, in a few weeks, that that will be where I go, right. And the entire time I haven't gotten one sales message through my Facebook. It hasn't said, Hey, buy this now we've got this big deal. Wow. Slowly at first I started getting, you know, uh, some ads based on the cars. I like just going over. They were videos doing like inside, outside tour of the car is what you can expect.

Cross (13:15):

Um, that I really enjoyed because now I'm getting to know not just the brand, but the salesperson. So I feel like about almost kind of a connection there with them. And two, I'm getting all the information I need on the car without having to go through and read, which always is good to me. The more time I can save about half of the read about something, uh, the more I'm willing to go there. Right? And then as time went on, I started to see some more stuff about just like culture there. So there was one just the sales guy talking about, you know, what you can expect in terms of the relationship, not, you know, if you buy a car, we're going to save you a ton of money, but no. What, so when you come in, you know, we've got this nice area we're going to sit, we're going to talk, find out, you know, what's best for you because I may want a $70,000 truck right now.

Cross (14:02):

But reality is a, is my budget gonna afford a $70,000 buck? And B, do I really need that truck? Right. I could probably get, you know, a much cheaper option. That's better suited for me. And it was really cool to see that somebody was willing to tell you that because if I went onto most lots and said, Hey, I want that because that's a truck. Yeah. They're just going to give it to me. So the house, somebody really flipped that on its head was really a cool wake up call. And then since then, it's just been, you know, minor ads to keep their name top of funnel or top of mind. And slowly, slowly, now I've reached time. I think about the fact that I need to go get a new car. I'm like, Oh, shoot. I need to go see a, it ends up being, I printed it out, but it's a local Dodge dealership here. And they come to mind constantly because they're just always slowly giving me some information and we'll never really ask for that big purchase.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (14:53):

Yeah. It gets back to our initial con you know, we talked about the conversation between somebody doing the work, but it also goes between us and our customers. We have to have that conversation because, you know, unfortunately in the, in the past, if you walked onto the lot and said, uh, I'd like to look at the 70,000 when I'm, I'm going to be like, actually we've got a 90,001 over here that I'm going to try. Do you want to, you know, we don't, it's selfish, but, um, you know, we're always, I guess we think that this is going to be the last sale that we ever make. And so we always try to push somebody up instead of thinking about, I want to make this customer for life. So what do you need? You know, the question, and I'm just kind of using your example, but you know, what are you going to use this for?

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (15:36):

Do you really need that with this 40,001 certifies because, uh, you know, trying to do the right thing for your customer. And it's just like in a, you know, in my business and I don't want to sell them, sell somebody, a bunch of stuff that they may or may not need. I would rather try to give them what they, what they need, what they want, because I want them to come back. I want them to feel that I'm honest. I don't want to, I don't want them to walk away at some point and say, wow, I just got ripped off because I got sold all this stuff. You know, it may have done what I said I was going to do, but it was like stuff that somebody didn't really need. So again, having that conversation to try to determine what are the needs of you, your client, the other thing you, you bring up, that's kind of a, another soap box of mine is the, the, the way that we follow up.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (16:29):

And if I was to ever get your email, you know, a lot of times you, you get these like, okay, you came in and he looked at my vehicle's like, Hey, cross, you came in on last Tuesday night and looked at this truck. Are you ready yet? Can you come in and sign the papers, you know, instead, and not, and maybe, maybe it has to do with the product, but I look at it that, uh, in my business, especially, I want to educate you and say something, you know, more something on the order of, Hey, I know you came in last Thursday talking about this. Here's some more information, not necessarily about me, my company, but it could be, you know, a great article. So, you know, what I've done before has taken article that I read, pull out four bullet points and say, Hey, cross, I just saw this four great bullet points on this vehicle that you're looking at buying and just leave it at that, you know, we do.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (17:22):

I think as salespeople, you know, we have the walk, the line because we have to ask for the sale. I mean, at some point I've got to say cross, yeah, let's, let's get this done. But on the other hand, it can't be cross nice to meet you. Here's the truck let's get this deal done. I mean, that's where we take out that, uh, the, that middle section and then that we need to take the time to really cultivate this relationship. Like said too, you mentioned build trust. You need to trust me that we're doing the right thing. It's so important, but I think that's a big part of what we skip nowadays. I just want to send you an email and then I want you to email me back saying, uh, let's buy the Nina, let's get this thing done. And it just, I don't know. What is these, what are the current stats on, uh, touches before somebody actually makes a purchase?

Cross (18:14):

Yeah, it's crazy. I mean, depending on who you ask and how their funnel is set up, it's very drastically different, but what I've seen, uh, I love to use the Facebook attribution tool, um, just because it gives me a sense I can hook up all my different ad platforms to it and aggregate everyone's information. Okay. And it's crazy. You really get to see, uh, I'll use dealerships as an example. Uh, dealerships has been an interesting one because I've seen that some will start off on their mobile, probably just looking up because they're like, shoot, I need a new car. They end up on the site, they touched a little bit. Then, uh, they go on their desktop usually. And I've noticed that that's where we start to see a little bit more consideration based stuff going on. They're really diving into the information they're booking consultations, requesting pre quotes. Uh, and then we'll see it on move to mobile again, where a lot of touch points happen. And that's usually their Google ads, their Facebook and other types of ads going on and coming back. So it really is multi-platform multitouch and I wouldn't even put a number on it. I'd just say it's long journeys these days, and it's so many different ways.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (19:18):

Yeah. I think, um, again, the higher, the price point, probably the more touches that we're going to have to have in the more patients that we need to have to educate our customers. Because obviously if it's a high ticket item, it's probably more complex than, you know, the gadget on somebody's website for three or $5. So we have to educate and, uh, which kind of leads us to the point of price versus value. And, you know, I'm in the service business, I'm huge in value because I don't ever want to be a price leader. I mean, cause peop somebody will always beat you on price. So what's the, uh, yeah. So what is the advantages to, uh, you know, kind of sticking to that value proposition versus, Oh, I'm just the lowest or, you know, going for the price.

Cross (20:13):

Exactly. Value is a big thing. And something else you mentioned a little while ago was giving information, which is two really big things. So, uh, I was recently helping a business who does, um, they sell trailers, but what they do during the winter is they will go through and like winterize your trailer for the, when you come back, it's all good. They drain all the pipes, all that fun stuff. And they're ad every year for like the last 30 years has just been a photo that says, this is, you know, our name. This is what we're doing. So we're going to winterize your trailer and here's the price and said, how much does that actually work? And they had really low ROS, if anything, and out of our bringing maybe six customers and they were pumping it with thousands of dollars. And I said, okay, let's take one video of you just telling people how to winterize it themselves, give them all the information upfront so that they can do it.

Cross (21:06):

And at the end say, you know, what, if you're, you know, rushed on time or, you know, you just don't want to do it, your starting number, give us a call and we'll gladly out and do it. Uh, and automatically they saw an increase like crazy and all this stuff was a hundred dollars on the video because they didn't trust me at first. They're like, we'll see how this goes. They're just going to do it themselves. And I was like, I promise you, if you tell them how to do it, they'll understand that you know your stuff and there'll be much more willing than if they just saw, Hey, we do this. Here's the price. And, uh, since then people have a lot more trust for them. They also noticed that people who were winterizing with, um, from this video were much more likely to convert on new trailers and stuff too, because they have got this confidence in you because you weren't trying to sell them at the start. You were giving them information and providing them with the tools that they need. Yeah.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (21:59):

Yeah. That's similar to a, I read this in a book years ago, but this one guy had this marketing plan. And so it was a jewelry store and what they had done some analysis and figured that they had like a 50%, um, conversion of well of making first-time buyers, long-time customer. So if you bought something for them, 50% chance, you're coming back to buy something else. So what he did, he went out to professionals, doctors, lawyers, and he, he devised a campaign that said, okay, as being, uh, you know, we want to, the doctor's position was we want to thank you for being our customer jewelry company said, we will provide, you know, what the doctor said, we've worked out this deal with X, Y, Z jewelry to give you a 50% off your first purchase. And so then it was win-win because the professional sent them out to their customers.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (22:58):

Customers are thinking, wow, this guy really went the extra mile for us to get this discount. We get a 50% discount, but the jewelry stores thinking, even if I give away my first sale, I know that 50% of these people will come back and buy something else. So, you know, we have to kind of think outside the box, interesting concepts like that. And I think like you said, um, number one, this trailer company, they showed people they knew, but also if there were different things that they were doing above the competition, they kind of highlighted, we go the extra mile for you as the customer. And then the other thing it's like with me, I see that. And I'm like, Oh, I thought it was just turning the tap to drain the water. I didn't know how to do all of these things now. It's like, I don't have time to do that. Or I'd rather take it to the expert and just let them handle it.

Cross (23:51):

Exactly. And it's really cool. I love working with Julie companies because I've learned that they can be really, um, unique in how they do stuff. So a lot of people just think, you know, it always sends back the price. And so Julie, a lot of times we'll just like, okay, we're having a big 50% off sale today. Um, and one of the best campaigns I've run for a jewelry store instead of giving any kind of discount. What they did was, um, if you came in and purchased over a thousand dollars jewelry, you were get, uh, what came to about a hundred dollars, $120 cleaning kit for your jewelry, with all the products you need to be able to really shine it up and make them sparkle like new. And they had a ton of purchases cause people really wanted that for the long run. And then what they also saw is people didn't then expect something.

Cross (24:37):

The next time they came back, because the second you give somebody a discount, people said to expect discounts. Like I know there's certain restaurants I go to cause I know they always have a discount. And if I ever went there and they did have a discount, I might just leave and go find out special back at it. Whereas if you give someone something for free, they're not going to always expect, like I wasn't going to go back there. If they gave me a free dessert and be like, okay, next time I go, they're going to give me a free dessert again. And it's really interesting that that's how it works. Like if you start discounting, it's just expected. But if you give someone a little gift, it goes a long way and it don't always expect that.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (25:12):

Yeah. And people love those free gifts. I mean, yeah. It doesn't matter how small they are, but people love to feel like they're getting something, you know, for being, uh, being your customer. So, um, how do we integrate, um, our emails? So, you know, I get somebody to sign up, I get their email. So what is a good plan to time these, uh, how, how often do we want to send them out? Things like that.

Cross (25:43):

Yeah. So, uh, I'm gonna tell you something different on this one. This is something where I usually say, uh, based on just even personal preference. I hate when I get emails weekly or daylight, there's one guy in my inbox right now. I just need to unsubscribe it from, but I don't read anything because daily, he sends me an email and it just drives me crazy. Nobody's got the time to read that much content. Nobody wants to see you that much. Right. Um, I've always said bi-weekly or monthly is usually the best when it comes to emails in his letter, especially if you want to have a high open rate. Um, cause the more you get in people's face, the more we're kind of tiring that's, especially on. Yeah.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (26:19):

Yeah. And dependent upon, uh, you know, kind of what stage you're in. You bring up a good point about not looking at emails and I'll know, uh, you know, I'm still kind of the old fashioned that look at a lot of mine. You know, the unlike you, I have those same people every day I just get rid of, but it's another part of our conversation with our client, with our trying to build this relationship is how, what is the best way me to contact you? How do you like to be contacted? Then let let your buyer tell you, cause you will be surprised that buyers mostly expect that they're going to be contacted. Very few are naive enough to think they're going to walk in somewhere and get you're going to give them, uh, you're going to try to sell them. They don't buy in that. You're not going to follow up in some way. So, you know, if they say I don't want anything, then you have to respect that don't follow up. But a lot of times they will gladly give you an email or they may be, they want a text or something like that. So just be sure and ask that question. Yeah.

Cross (27:18):

A hundred percent. And it's funny what you'll learn to. Um, for example, I was working with a business and Toronto, Ontario, there's a lot of universities, a lot colleges. And so they have a lot of international students and I was working in the business who asked that question. They were like, what's the best way to contact you and like to keep communications up. And their number one response was WhatsApp because a lot of them were international students. Yeah. And it was something that they'd never even thought of. They were like, okay, we got emails, social media, we've covered all our bases. And they were like, no, no, if you WhatsApp me, that's the best way because I'm on there talking to family, I use it for like, even my communications out here. Cause they don't need to pay for, uh, like mobile service. They can use wifi and it was really awesome for them. And then, um, WhatsApp's also kind of nice because it's owned by Facebook. So there's a lot of integration there that if you want to advertise through it still, you still have that ability.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (28:09):

Yeah. I'll have to admit. I'm not, uh, I'm a slow adopter. I haven't made it around to one WhatsApp yet. I can barely work my, my phone and my email. So I'm trying not to add anything right now, but yeah, that's a good point that, you know, we just never know and we want to reach people where they are. Uh, one, one other thing to kind of, while we're talking about messaging is the importance of being honest, truthful, um, because, and the reason I thought of this, I've got a guy that started texting me. They, um, you know, it's that time a window when we sign up for new health insurance at the end of the year. And so I had a guy that called me from a far away city or I knew where he was and said, Hey, you know, I'm your, uh, insurance rep health and care representative.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (29:00):

And then, you know, I started getting all these texts from his office, like, Hey, I worked for this guy and we're your new representative? And they weren't. I mean, all cause you know, I know who my representative is and it's not them. So, you know, I just think instead of tricking somebody, cause that's all, I mean, you may trick me into calling you, but I'm just going to be mad. You're not your, I think your chances of turning somebody very slim. Uh, but I guess, you know, it's predatory. Maybe they just try to get unsuspecting people. But I think that we really have to look at our messaging, be honest, be transparent because we want to reach people who want to, who need our product would maybe want to buy our product. You know, we don't want to be just hassling people just because we have their email.

Cross (29:51):

Exactly. And it's funny, you mentioned, I just had recently on LinkedIn, so I'm VP at a big media agency. And so most of the roles that I need are marketing related role and I've put up a post just saying, Hey, we're hiring. Like, let me know if you want interview or if you have a resume and I'll a pass along and had this guy send them his resume, he was like, yeah, I really liked the talk. And I took a look at his LinkedIn before we hopped on the call. So I shouldn't even have accepted it. But I saw that he had like a small agency, I thought maybe, okay. Maybe he just wants to move over. And I got him on the phone for, what's supposed to be an interview. And for an hour he tried to sell me on why I should outsource the work to him. And I was like, are you kidding me? I was like, now you've put a really sour taste in my mouth. Right. All I'm going to do is anytime somebody asks about you or I see you on social. Cause I'm going to bad mouth because I have this new tricks to me. Like I didn't want to get sued by you thought this was an interview.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (30:48):

Right? Yeah. And you know, I'm glad you bring that up to the LinkedIn component because I think LinkedIn is it's uh, what, depending on what you sell, it's a good platform to reach out to other professionals, especially if you have a service. But again, I think that there's an etiquette that we have to follow and uh, you know, it's like, I am, I guess what they call the open source or whatever, where, you know, I will accept anybody's, uh, request. I'm not, you know, I want to build my network because I feel like that, you know, I can refer people out to things that I don't do. So I always love having a big network of other providers or other professionals. Well, what, um, you know, what I dislike is that sometimes, you know, once you join somebody, then all of a sudden you get the, that marketing email right back on top, instead of trying to build a relationship or give me time to see really who you are, what you do. And then also it it's for something that is totally nothing that I would ever need or use. And so, um, you know, I realized some of that is probably part of getting caught up in a wider net, but can you kind of speak to, uh, using LinkedIn as a marketing platform?

Cross (32:11):

Yeah. I really love like that. So if you're trying to build awareness, the two best platforms right now, um, because of the lack of content on them compared to things like Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter is tic talk and LinkedIn, their algorithms are so nice. And the amount of content is so little compared to these other platforms that you can put out one post and just blow up. That's all really takes. So I really recommend beyond these types of platforms, if they fit you, um, and keeping things on LinkedIn professional based, but also understanding that it's not a sales tool at the end of the day. So my biggest pet peeve as a consumer or a viewer on LinkedIn is when someone sends me a connection request and their first message is a sales message, right? It's the easiest way to get deleted from my network is the, send me that as your first message, right?

Cross (33:08):

And I always say, treat us a little bit as social media. So you've got your posting giving out content and then the sales funnel think of it or on the message side. Think of it as in-person sales, you wouldn't talk to me and be like, Hey, I've got a product for you. You should buy it. You would try to butter me up at least like, you'd be like, Hey, this is what you do. Awesome. This is what I do. Maybe at the end, you give me a business card. I say, I'll also reach out to you. And then maybe a week later, try to sell me. Yeah. But don't just reach out and expect to get sales because it just makes most, I've never heard somebody who enjoys getting outreach to for sales and the first message

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (33:42):

And you bring up, that's a good, a good analogy is that when, uh, you know, if we were to meet in person, we wouldn't shake hands and I'm like, you know, here's a invoice. If you'll just go ahead and sign up for this. I mean, it's, and I think that, I guess that we feel social media of some is that some distance that, you know, people think that they can do anything and get away with it, but we really have to kind of think of it as that in-person meeting and what would we do? How would we do that? We want to learn a little bit more, because again, you have to ask the question as the salesperson w what are your needs, you know, and in some, I would rather have somebody just asked me, you know, what are your needs? I can tell them I don't have any.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (34:23):

And, and also we should not get upset if we send out a message and we don't get a response from somebody because, you know, we're intruding on their time. And time is important for all of us. So just like myself, I mean, I may get 50 of those LinkedIn messages a day. I mean, if I just took five minutes for each one of those, if you can imagine, you know, you can multiply that, see how much time it would burn up to try to respond to everyone. So also patients that, you know, if people aren't interested in, we have to move on. There's actually a good book somewhere about called getting to know. And, you know, sometimes getting to know it, at least lets me know, you're not interested. We can move on and not waste any more time there. So just, uh, be, uh, just be kind and be responsible even on LinkedIn. Uh, it's very, very important. And

Cross (35:19):

It's funny that you said time too, and like people are busy. So another thing I'd see on LinkedIn all the time is even if I am looking at getting someone service is they'll send me a message. I'll read it, but I'm also working throughout the day. Right. So I'll come back to it when I have time. And if I don't mess this on back right away, I'll normally see 20 minutes later, get another message like, Hey, are you still there? Like, uh, you know, limited time. And I'm like, now you're just bothering me. At least to me, it's 24 hours. Like, I'll text you. Right. I'm not just going to go see you on this. Yeah. And I understand you need to reach out back at some point, but give it some time. Don't just like harass people. Cause you're just going to push away that sale. You're doing the opposite of what you think you're doing.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (35:58):

Yeah. Because we always need to keep in mind that even if you don't buy today, it doesn't mean that you may not need my product or service in the future. So we always have to protect those relationships. The other thing that you mentioned that, uh, I'm so out of touch with Tik TOK and tell me how a professional or even a professional services or somebody with a product would use that because I'm going to be honest and say the only thing I thought it was was like a dance platform of some kind. So

Cross (36:31):

Definitely. So I love brands who can use tech talk very well. There were some at the beginning who came out and they were just showed their representatives dancing. But for example, Starbucks said this a lot. At the beginning, I saw a lot of like local Starbucks around here who would just have their like baristas dance, the songs. And it doesn't make me want to come in anymore. It doesn't make me want a Starbucks coffee. Um, they were just trying to go with the trend, but then there were people who use it in a very meaningful way. Uh, there's someone I've been looking at purchasing, you makes a custom metal art and what he does, all his videos are just him showing you how he does it. Like he's giving away all his secrets. He just builds it in front of you in a minute long video.

Cross (37:13):

So he speeds it up. Yeah. It's really interesting a to watch it's nice content, if you don't want to purchase, and those who are looking, it was really cool to see the dedication he puts into the work is not trying to sell me on it again, he's just building it and showing me his work. But now I've gotten value out of the content it's meaningful. It's not just people dancing. And then, you know, in the comments, your usually puts a link so that if you want to purchase, you can then go check it out. I can message him.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (37:43):

And, um, I know that Tik TOK had a little bit of a scrape with the, uh, in the us a few months ago. And I, my understanding is they've got all that worked out. So it is going to be a sustainable platform in the foreseeable future going forward. So we shouldn't be scared to spend some time and money over there. Correct.

Cross (38:05):

Definitely. I don't see it going away anytime soon. What I would say is I definitely prefer to put my aide media on other sources. Um, the reason for that is it's really hard when things are so quick, like tech talks very short, uh, short form content. The longest thing you've got is a minute there. Um, so it's attention spans really flare up and it's really easy to just skip ads on Tik TOK too. You just got to keep scrolling. Um, so my paid media, I definitely prefer to focus on larger platforms like Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram, where there's a little more longer format to it. Um, but I definitely feel like if you're looking at organic social tech talks a great way to do it, because like I said, there's not a lot of content on the platform yet compared to big platforms. Okay. And the algorithm is really unique in terms of, you know, instead of prioritizing like you as the engagement on it. People who have no followers can blow up overnight because it's just like content is good.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (39:04):

Okay. Yeah. And I think that's the, uh, another, um, value of hiring a professional like yourself is that, you know, you have more in depth knowledge of all these because of what the other thing I was going to lead up to was that we really need to research the platforms and the audience that we will reach there because I would just suspect that tick-tock is going to be a younger audience. Versus if I have a professional service where I'm trying to market to, um, you know, businesses, I doubt many of them reside are going to be there picking up my ads where that would be more of a LinkedIn. Whereas if you're looking at a, probably a middle-aged to older consumer with a smaller dollar item that may be, you know, putting your money into Facebook, different things like that. Yeah.

Cross (39:57):

And it's funny how quick things change. So I'm still only 22 right now. And I'm heavily on the Facebook platform have been for years. Cause I was really the first social media for me and I was talking to a family friend, who's got a kid who's 19. So only a couple of years younger than me. Doesn't have a Facebook, doesn't have an Instagram. They're only on things like YouTube and Tik TOK. Right, right.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (40:22):

Yeah. And we've got, uh, we've got one of those two that she's, you know, 26, 27 that no Facebook account. And so it's, it's funny that you say that maybe it's kinda making a resurgence because it seemed like there was a group and I always kind of accused the kids of, well y'all are getting all getting off of Facebook because your parents and grandparents are on there. So you got to move off and find something different, but maybe there's a group coming back over there. Uh, so yeah, the, I think those are, you know, important points to make is that there's a lot of great avenues out there, but you just have to know, you know, where your audience is going to reside for your product service, price point, things like that. So, um, if you're doing page, you can definitely do where you're going to get the biggest bang for your buck. For sure.

Cross (41:13):

Exactly. And one thing I've got to say this, um, pixels are so, so bored, especially that Facebook pixel. I love Facebook business, my best friend, because, um, as much as I liked my Google ads at the end of the day, all someone has to do is clear their cache and all that information goes away and I've got to rebuild that retargeting audience. Whereas I found retargeting on Facebook and Instagram is so nice because it's people-based, uh, so it's very cross-device because my laptop, my phone, my TV, even all have the exact same Facebook profiles hooked up to them. So no matter where I go, Hmm, I'm getting those retargeting ads through the pixels. And the best part about it is yes, you can remove your data from a pixel, but it's very hard. There are a few people who can tell you how to go on Facebook and check off the right box that you're not getting those retargeting ads. It's not as simple as just saying clear my history. Right.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (42:13):

Okay. Well, Krause, thanks so much for taking time out of your day to be with us. You've given us a lot of great information to think about. And, um, one thing I'd like to ask is what is the tool that you use either a tool or a habit or ritual something you do every day that you couldn't do without either your business or personal life?

Cross (42:35):

Yeah. I think a big thing for me when it comes to business is stepping back and like we decided really thinking about our audience. So I've always been addicted to a, I forget the movie. It was a, I think it's called think like a woman or something like that. It was an old movie where he's in marketing and like, he starts to think like a woman he puts on like her clothing and stuff like that. Uh, and he gets in character and I fully believe that that's a great thing to do. I will sit there and just pretend I'm the consumer to really understand what is their thought process, where are they going to grow? Uh, and I think the more you can get into who your consumer are, the better you're really going to do in business.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (43:16):

Yeah. Not to keep going. We could probably talk for hours and hours, but I think that's an, that's a good point to make is that, uh, even if you have an existing business or product, you always need to sit down and kind of design your avatar of your customer, who is the, and it changes. So, I mean, it's something you need to revisit, but these are good questions. Who is it? Uh, where do they, you know, again, where do they reside? So I can know where to target them, but you know, what are their buying habits? You know, I talked to a gentleman not long ago that, you know, they were doing a bunch of, um, YouTube ads. It was a karate studio. So they were doing these YouTube ads. They were reaching kids, you know, but unfortunately the kids, weren't the one that had the buying power to go to the studio and do this.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (44:07):

But he said, you know, after about two weeks a month, the kids actually kind of nagged the parents enough to take them in. And so it ended up being successful. It was just a little bit of delay. And so, but a good strategy is that, you know, if we can, if we can get the kids interested, sometimes they can convince to, so really sit down and think about, you know, who's your customer, who's got the buying power, how they act and, uh, revisit that every six months because things change. I mean, we're always in flux, so, well tell us, uh, number one, uh, who is your client? What can you do for them and then how they can reach out and get a hold of you?

Cross (44:51):

Yeah. So I've actually do a lot more consulting on my own outside of secret sauce lately for brands because secret sauce is more geared towards content creators. So I deal a lot with, you know, more local, small, medium sized businesses. I'm still working on my new website, so that's under construction, but if you go on Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, anything, uh, my handle's always the same. It's just Cross Palalas, C R O S S P a L a L a S, definitely send me a message and we can always talk about even just conversational, what you can do to improve your business. And then we can always talk about services later.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (45:29):

Okay, great. Well, again, thanks a lot for taking time out of your day to be here. It's been a great conversation. I look forward to having you back soon and you can tell us, uh, you know, kind of update us and tell us what's going on.

Cross (45:40):

Thank you for having me. It was a great time. You bet.

Roy - The Business of Business Podcast (45:43):

You bet. All right, well, thanks again for listening again. This is the business of business podcast. I'm Roy. Uh, you can find us at www dot the business of business podcast. We have a player so you can listen to, uh, share with your friends so they can listen to this episode and others. We're also on all the major platforms, iTunes, Google play, Stitcher, Spotify. Uh, if we're not on one that you like, please reach out. I'll be glad to get us on there. Also, we do post the, uh, videos of these, uh, episodes on YouTube. So you can go over there and check this out as well until next time I'm Roy take care of yourself.

 

 

 

wwww.thebusinessofbusinesspodcast.com